We've always been at war with Eastasia

[sombrefan]

When did the Bangels stop loving the last half of Season 8 and start hating it? (And that's a serious fandom question, so no petty sniping or wankery in the comments please).

Comments

[norwie2010.livejournal.com]

Great head line. :)

As far as i understand the whole shipping issue, most "shippers" are rather male centered fans (that is, a lot of Banders are Xander fans foremost, as are Bangels Angel fans first and Buffy fans second, same with Spuffy. I didn't do a scientific study on this, obviously - it is just the feeling i get when reading forums and boards and whatnot).

I think season 8 was always going to piss off Angel fans, but at least Bangel fans could mentally put it off for a while when "their couple" space frakked a new universe into existence (i mean, they got "baby fic" Whedon-style ;-)).

Season 8 shows Angel at a low point, which consequently leads to a low point of his relationship with the heroine (hello, "Seeing Red" someone?).

And when shipping is the main motivating factor in Your fan existence - then of course this is going to suck big time.

But perhaps i'm interpreting fan reactions all wrong and the Bangels just see it like it is. ;-)

[boot-the-grime.livejournal.com]

As far as i understand the whole shipping issue, most "shippers" are rather male centered fans (that is, a lot of Banders are Xander fans foremost, as are Bangels Angel fans first and Buffy fans second, same with Spuffy. I didn't do a scientific study on this, obviously - it is just the feeling i get when reading forums and boards and whatnot).

Yes, I've noticed that tendency. Many shippers are like that. And it's not just that they're centered on their favorite male character - it's that many of them don't seem to like Buffy much, or even intensely dislike her and continually bash her for allegedly not treating their boy right, or for not doing enough to prove her eternal love for him, or for having an interest in other males.

But I don't think it's most shippers. A lot of people who are big Buffy fans are also shippers - they have a clear preference for one of her ships (and are usually also the fans of the other character in question) but are more likely to see things from Buffy's POV, instead of treating her as a trophy for their favorite guy. I don't know about the other groups, but can safely say at least that there are many Spuffers who love both Buffy and Spike, and predominantly relate to Buffy, or to both of them - as opposed to others who predominantly identify with Spike and not really with Buffy. Basically, all Spuffy shippers love Spike, but not all Spuffy shippers like Buffy. I've seen - and participated - in some very heated debates between those two groups. The second group's views (when it comes to the interpretation of Buffy's actions and feelings) often tend to be more similar to those of the most hardcore of Bangels, as bizarre as that is.

[norwie2010.livejournal.com]

:D

I would like to quote every second sentance of Your post and answer with a resounding "YES!".

Ah, the downfall of an androcentristic culture...

Here on LJ i have encountered a lot of Spuffy-friendly folks who are very Buffy-centric. But, once i wander out into the brave new world of internet fandom (i'm relatively new to online fandom) it gets really mind boggling. And, as i said: I have no "formal" evidence of most , it is just a gut feeling. Since most (hehe) readers of Buffy season 8 are not in online fandom that might very well distort the perception.

I don't want to clobber up Simon's LJ - but i just have to say that i do indeed enjoy every single post of Yours i have read here on LJ and buffyforums. :)

(Sorry, Simon, for using Your space - but it had to be said.)

[kerry-220.livejournal.com]

I think it's when an action is completely inexplicable/inexcusable/incomprehensible. So....the neck snapping would be it. I've read some of the most extraordinary rationalisations up until that point, but nothing since.

However, if my current theories are correct, the expired character will be revived and all the Bangels will need to deal with is excessive levels of brooding.

[moscow-watcher.livejournal.com]

After #39, apparently. As strange as it sounds, people were really expecting a happy ending for Bangel. Not a "wedding and many children" kind of happy ending, but an "epic lovers fighting against evil and shagging between fights" kind of ending.

[menomegirl.livejournal.com]

I think that's been a gradual shift and hasn't happened as suddenly as you may have perceived it. From my perspective, some-not all but some-Bangels didn't like the way the space-sex went down. Some didn't like it when Buffy's relationship with Spike was not made as irrelevant as they had hoped.

But I personally think that the main reason is that most of them are really disappointed and angry at the way the character of Angel has been all but destroyed in season 8. That makes more sense to me than anything else.

So I don't tend to think of it as a shipper thing at all.

[boot-the-grime.livejournal.com]

But I personally think that the main reason is that most of them are really disappointed and angry at the way the character of Angel has been all but destroyed in season 8. That makes more sense to me than anything else.

But Angel fans who are not Bangel shippers (or used to be moderate Bangels, but have been disappointed by the turn of events in S8) mostly seem to have hated Angel's role this season from the start. On the other hand, there are hardcore Bangels who were very happy with the space sex and its immediate aftermath (at least before #37 when Buffy committed the sin of fantasizing about Spike), until Twilight/Angel broke Giles' neck.

[menomegirl.livejournal.com]

...there are hardcore Bangels who were very happy with the space sex and its immediate aftermath (at least before #37 when Buffy committed the sin of fantasizing about Spike), until Twilight/Angel broke Giles' neck.

That's a more detailed example of what I meant when I said there's been a gradual shift in the way Bangel fans feel about S8.